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Jane_
FemaleFirst Chatter (200+ Posts)
Joined: 15 Jun 2006
Posts: 379
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 Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 9:50 pm Post subject: Is Monogamy Natural? |
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We all crave some form of intimacy. Evolutionary biologists say pair bonding is a natural human instinct. This is what we do.
However is it also natural to crave intimacy with others, sometimes many others, and do we suppress those instincts because we are told it is "wrong".
Is there a biological predisposition towards human monogamy?
Or is what drives us toward a monogamous mating system purely cultural, that is, we are fed the idea that monogamy is best for everyone and our polyamorous instincts are effectively reigned in. |
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kinghelfer
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 30 May 2005
Posts: 10386
Location: ....... Paddle Faster - I Can Hear Banjo,s.......
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 10:03 pm Post subject: |
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 ....Your Horny Again...Arent You.......?¿?  |
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Topic Of Gossip
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 03 Mar 2005
Posts: 5171
Location: London
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| Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:37 am Post subject: Re: Is Monogamy Natural? |
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| Jane_ wrote: |
We all crave some form of intimacy. Evolutionary biologists say pair bonding is a natural human instinct. This is what we do.
However is it also natural to crave intimacy with others, sometimes many others, and do we suppress those instincts because we are told it is "wrong".
Is there a biological predisposition towards human monogamy?
Or is what drives us toward a monogamous mating system purely cultural, that is, we are fed the idea that monogamy is best for everyone and our polyamorous instincts are effectively reigned in. |
Interesting question.
My answer would be... "no".
I don't feel humans are inherently monogamous. I mean, I wonder how many affairs and coveting of other people's partners have gone on since the creation of humankind? 
However, we are a species that survives on rules and order, especially as civilisations grow larger and larger. If our societies are to function in an orderly fashion then monogamy kind of makes sense.
Of course the 'Harem' or polygamy models could also work just as well if people could agree. But people are generally "selfish" when it comes to love.
With the advent of certain religions this further enforced the practice of monogamy particularly in the Western world.
It's interesting that in France, it's kind of well known that many married men have mistresses. Same thing kind of happens in Jamaica. It's just that many partners who know their spouse is having an 'extra portion on the side' sometimes choose to "ignore" the fact, especially where they feel the cohesion of their family unit is ultimately more important than any infidelity or impropriety their other half may get up to. |
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GayandProud
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 06 Dec 2007
Posts: 3836
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| Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 11:50 am Post subject: |
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| Jane wrote: |
| Is there a biological predisposition towards human monogamy? |
I dont think so. I mean biologically women would seek the best most healthy genes so that means sperm for their eggs and that means the sperms are in competition so in order to get the best sperm many partners is better than one. The best sperm wins. Men also biologically have better chance of spreading their genes with many partners, so from a biological point of view monogamy isnt natural.
Its more cultural in my view. I dont think I know anyone who hasnt lusted after a few different people all at the same time. Its a natural human instinct to fancy people and want to "have" them. Its just we dont give in to it .....  |
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Fred75
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 04 Oct 2007
Posts: 7288
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| Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 2:25 pm Post subject: Re: Is Monogamy Natural? |
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| Jane_ wrote: |
We all crave some form of intimacy. Evolutionary biologists say pair bonding is a natural human instinct. This is what we do.
However is it also natural to crave intimacy with others, sometimes many others, and do we suppress those instincts because we are told it is "wrong".
Is there a biological predisposition towards human monogamy?
Or is what drives us toward a monogamous mating system purely cultural, that is, we are fed the idea that monogamy is best for everyone and our polyamorous instincts are effectively reigned in. |
Yes. I believe women are predisposed for monogamy.
They understand that children need stability.
What changed this fundamental idea is things like contraception and abortion which free's the woman to act more like street walking ho.
I also think your confusing intimacy/love etc.. with LUST/SEX. |
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The Colonel
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 20 Aug 2007
Posts: 8191
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| Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 2:41 pm Post subject: Re: Is Monogamy Natural? |
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| Jane_ wrote: |
We all crave some form of intimacy. Evolutionary biologists say pair bonding is a natural human instinct. This is what we do.
However is it also natural to crave intimacy with others, sometimes many others, and do we suppress those instincts because we are told it is "wrong".
Is there a biological predisposition towards human monogamy?
Or is what drives us toward a monogamous mating system purely cultural, that is, we are fed the idea that monogamy is best for everyone and our polyamorous instincts are effectively reigned in. |
No we are not. As a species we evolved to have sex with multiple partners, that is how the species (in the EEA) survived and allowed for a mixed gene pool.
Many behaviours that are considered wrong or maladaptive now, were in the EEA benefitical for survival.
Men had the duty to spread their seed as much as possible and women had the duty to mate with the best of partners to allow the best genes to continue to the next generation. |
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Topic Of Gossip
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 03 Mar 2005
Posts: 5171
Location: London
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| Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 3:12 pm Post subject: Re: Is Monogamy Natural? |
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| Fred75 wrote: |
Yes. I believe women are predisposed for monogamy.
They understand that children need stability.
What changed this fundamental idea is things like contraception and abortion which free's the woman to act more like street walking ho.
I also think your confusing intimacy/love etc.. with LUST/SEX. |
Well... how come there are many men, who are unknowingly, raising children that are not their own i.e. they think they are the biological fathers but unfortunately they are not...
| Liverpool John Moores University study wrote: |
A study from Liverpool John Moores University in the UK has found up to 1 in 25 fathers are unknowingly raising another man's child.
The research, reported in the Journal of Epidemiology and Community Health, was drawn from studies of men and women wanting proof of paternity from testing as well as studies based on genetic health screening. The researchers in Liverpool found that rates of cases where a man was not the biological father of his child ranged from 1% in some studies to as much as 30%.
Experts have generally agreed the number of men unknowingly bringing up a child they believe to be their own is below ten per cent. A rate of four percent would mean one in 25 families is affected.
The Liverpool research headed by Professor Mark Bellis, looked at data from the UK, U.S., Canada, Europe, Russia, South Africa, South America, Mexico and New Zealand.
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Full Article: 1 in 25 Fathers not Biological Parent...
Obviously in these cases there was no abortion, and also an explicit lack of contraception.
I bring this up not to apportion blame Fred (as I know you're probably salivating to do) but to show that MEN and WOMEN will get up to all sorts irrespective of the institution of marriage, abortion or contraception.
Humans like sex.
Humans like to experience sex with different people.
This desire does not go away just because someone goes into a "societally dictated" monogamous relationship. For someone to stay faithful this desire is either consciously, or subconsciously, suppressed.
So for me, monogamy is not a "natural" human state. Though I know it may be a wish. |
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GayandProud
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 06 Dec 2007
Posts: 3836
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| Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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 thats what I was thinking too but you put it so much better tahn I could Topic. I think Fred has a one track mind.
From the cultural aspect I think its difficult for humans to stand out from the crowd as regards monogamy as theres so much stigma attched to having many partners even though if we were all honest about it we would all do it. marriage has a lot to do with keeping everyone in line in that respect. maybe thats why gay men are more promiscuous because we dont have this marraige thing hanging over us like heteros do. Just a thougt. |
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Fred75
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 04 Oct 2007
Posts: 7288
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| Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 4:55 pm Post subject: Re: Is Monogamy Natural? |
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| Topic Of Gossip wrote: |
| Fred75 wrote: |
Yes. I believe women are predisposed for monogamy.
They understand that children need stability.
What changed this fundamental idea is things like contraception and abortion which free's the woman to act more like street walking ho.
I also think your confusing intimacy/love etc.. with LUST/SEX. |
Well... how come there are many men, who are unknowingly, raising children that are not their own i.e. they think they are the biological fathers but unfortunately they are not...
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Because they married sluts that slept around. |
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myron myron
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 07 Sep 2006
Posts: 5583
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| Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 5:59 pm Post subject: |
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The Korean phrase "flower by the roadside" describes someone who is put on earth not to please one person, but to please many people.
There's nothing wrong or unnatural about that; if anything, such person is probably more natural than a monogamous person. |
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Lena
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 30 Apr 2004
Posts: 27629
Location: Kentucky , USA
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| Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 4:00 pm Post subject: |
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| For some yes , for some no .People are complicated and vary . |
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Fred75
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 04 Oct 2007
Posts: 7288
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| Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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| myron myron wrote: |
The Korean phrase "flower by the roadside" describes someone who is put on earth not to please one person, but to please many people.
There's nothing wrong or unnatural about that; if anything, such person is probably more natural than a monogamous person. |
We have those too in the USA.
We call'em w h o r e s. |
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myron myron
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 07 Sep 2006
Posts: 5583
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| Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Fred75 wrote: |
| myron myron wrote: |
The Korean phrase "flower by the roadside" describes someone who is put on earth not to please one person, but to please many people.
There's nothing wrong or unnatural about that; if anything, such person is probably more natural than a monogamous person.
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We have those too in the USA.
We call'em w h o r e s.
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But not all of them.
There are couples where both agree, either expressly or implicitly, that one partner may have sex outside the relationship while the other partner remains monogamous.
Based on anecdotal evidence from people I have encountered throughout my life, it appears to me that in such couples it is more common for the man to be the polyamorous one and the woman to be the monogamous one. I have run across many couples where the male partner has sex with others and the female does not, but I don't know if every such couple had an agreed arranagement.
The numerous threads in this forum by men who are willing "cuckolds" suggest that it is not uncommon in such couples for the woman to be the polyamorous one and the man to be the monogamous one. Living in New York City where one encounters every imaginable arrangement, I recall running across an openly "cuckold" couple a handful of times in my life. That doesn't necessarily mean such couples are rare; it may just mean they are less open about their arrangement. I have run across numerous couples where the female partner has sex with others and the male does not (though fewer than the other way around), but I don't know if every such couple had an agreed arrangement.
I don't pass moral judgement on how two adults choose to legally interact with each other and with other adults based on my personal boundaries in my personal relationships.
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Fred75
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 04 Oct 2007
Posts: 7288
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| Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 7:53 pm Post subject: |
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| myron myron wrote: |
I don't pass moral judgement on how two adults choose to legally interact with each other and with other adults based on my personal boundaries in my personal relationships.
[/size] |
Then you are a fool.
For some lifestyles are dangerous since they are high risk at spreading deadly diseases.
And they teach our children to place less value on themselves.
They begin to think they are pieces of meat to be passed around. |
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myron myron
FemaleFirst Guru
Joined: 07 Sep 2006
Posts: 5583
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| Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 8:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Fred75 wrote: |
| myron myron wrote: |
I don't pass moral judgement on how two adults choose to legally interact with each other and with other adults based on my personal boundaries in my personal relationships.
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Then you are a fool.
For some lifestyles are dangerous since they are high risk at spreading deadly diseases.
And they teach our children to place less value on themselves.
They begin to think they are pieces of meat to be passed around.
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I'm not talking about children; I'm talking about adults.
Polyamory does not necessarily spread any deadly diseases.
And "they" should not be in position to teach "our children to place less value on themselves" or anything else about values -- it's the parents' job to teach their own children values.
I have neither the time nor the inclination nor the qualifications to pass moral judgement on consensual behavior between and among adults that is legal and does not personally affect me. |
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